Face front, Crawlspacers! We are in Last Remains now and it is not for the faint of heart! You’re here, so I know you are up to the task, and it’s a good think considering all the wallcrawler is about to face. Join me as we determine if these .LR issues are required reading, or just supplemental material. That, and we will answer the question – “Who is the issue’s mystery woman?” I’m betting Deb Whitman. See if I’m right!
Credit Where Credit Is Due
Story Title: Fallen Order
Writer: Nick Spencer and Matthew Rosenberg
Artist: Federico Vicentini
Colorist: Marcio Menyz
Letterer: VC’s Joe Caramanga
Cover Artist: Sara Pichelli and Rachelle Rosenberg
Asst. Editor: Tom Groneman and Lindsey Cohick
Editor: Nick Lowe
Published: October 21, 2020
Remedial ASM 101
Kindred is making his move. Norman has been cleansed of his sins and powers. Sin-eater has been dissolved and all of his captured sins are possessing the Webinar The Order of the Web and now they want Spidey! Norman reveals that the identity of Kindred is none other than his son Harry!
The Story – Pay Attention, This Will Be on the Test
Stepping back in time, we get what happened in between issue 850 and 50 (yes, I know that numbering makes it look like I am an English teacher, but I swear it’s right!) which is Spidey gets his butt kicked by the EOoW and Norman seeks to make amends with Harry via Dr. Kafka. Oh, and enter Deb Whitman.
OK, I lied. Enter Mary Jane….
She does say that she’s not staying long. I’m not sure if that is a hint that she will not be around long in the book and if so, what does that mean for their relationship?
What Passed and Failed
PASS – The art is good. Faces are recognizable, the coloring was very well done, and Mary Jane looked like Mary Jane and not a Ditko villain. That’s about as far as I get into critiquing art.
FAIL – This image of Kindred.
This looks more like a version of the cute villain plushies we saw a villain stealing way be earlier in this run.
PASS – The action. The fight sequences flow from one panel to the other and are not just random images of fighting.
PASS – This!
Way to go Cohick! What a way to introduce yourself to the reader base!
Nick Lowe, are you taking notes? I’m so excited to get one of these, I’m going to forgive the fact that she’s a different clone from the clone conspiracy one, because frankly, does it really matter if it happened in the Ravencroft series?
FAIL – Underwater webbing – Would that even work? I’m trying to remember Spidey shooting webs underwater before and am coming up blank. I know they are mostly waterproof once he shoots them, but I’m not so sure they would work so well underwater (but I guess it is canon now!). While we are on that scene, the odd angle of the webbing here is weird – how is it not pulling taut? They look like Darkseid’s omega beams. I care not, it’s still better than Kirby’s crawling webs!
OOTI (Onomatopoeia of the Issue)
On a scale of 1 (POW) to 10 (BLRKBQRKPQRBLNB), THWIP rates a 6. It’s a classic sound effect, but I do like the attempt at making it look like an underwater sound effect!
Analysis
Spider-Man getting his butt handed to him in his own book – I’m not going to hold it against him here because he is obviously stronger than they are, but also just as obviously refusing to hurt them – and for good reason. Not only are these people his friends or people that look up to him as a role model, but also they are demons in large part because of his actions to throw Norman to Kindred. Granted, it is what Madam Web was lobbying for to begin with, but still, he made the choice. So, I can see why he is holding back here. I also wouldn’t put it past Kindred to make them weak defensively just so Peter has to live with more guilt for hurting those he loves while defending himself. Plus, Spidey does very well for someone trying not to hurt others. He takes and shrugs off this venom blast!
Who is the Mystery Girl?
Finally – MJ’s back – just in time to get dragged into this Kindred mess. And dragged in she is going to be. We know this specifically thanks to the magic of juxtaposition.
You see this used a lot in crime dramas – a scene ends with the detective saying, “But who else had access to the safe?” then switch scenes immediately to the secretary eating lunch at a restaurant. That lets the viewer know that she’s the one because while eating lunch has nothing to do with the crime, the fact that she is put right after that is important. Juxtaposition!*
Here, since MJ is appearing right after the question is asked, “Who could be an arbitrator between you and Harry?” suggests MJ, though what she has ever done to make Norman think she will give him a fair shot, I don’t know!
Who’s That Kindred?
Well, if you were still wondering if Norman meant Gabriel, we get confirmation that Norman certainly believes Kindred to be Harry and in an interview that Spencer did recently (see comments section of last issue) it seems pretty positive that there is no red herring here. So I’m officially retiring this segment of Alford Notes, but don’t worry, dear reader, I’m sure we can come up with a new segment!
Extra Credit
So either Anya has the powers to create spiders, being a demon gives the EOoW extra powers, or this isn’t Anya at all, but rather Carl King in disguise (and I am very sorry for those of you who know what that is a reference to). I am going to assume that being possessed by the sins of such evil people gives you more powers. Bonus points to anyone who can enlighten me on her abilities.
Final Grade
All in all, I really enjoyed this issue! The pacing, the art, the set up – it was all perfectly splendid.**
A-
I bounced around between a B+ and an A-. However, when I went back to read through it again to write this review, I liked it even more, so I decided to go with the higher grade.
Required Reading or Supplemental Material
The letters page only has a letter from Nick Lowe*** and it tells us a lot about how great these two writers are together (I think the comic supports that) and lets us know that the .LR issues are going to focus more on the non-Spider-Man characters. I think that is fair. I also appreciate them being up front about that rather than making me irritated that I am not getting Spidey in the book. I also thought it was a nice touch to give us Spidey in this book as a set up. However, the main story has already progressed beyond this point chronologically and the only thing that was a particularly important reveal was the arrival of Deb Whitman Mary Jane and that, while that is important, I don’t think we wouldn’t be able to follow Amazing Spider-Man #51 without it. That said, I am officially marking this:
SUPPLEMENTAL READING
But worth it!
What’s Next?
Nick Lowe has asked people to let the Spider office know how they are doing by sending an email to spideyoffice@marvel.com and to make sure you mark it “OK to print”. If you get published, make sure to draw our attention to it!
* I know you guys knew this, but I put it in for Neil’s sake.
** Yes, I watched The Haunting of Bly Manor.
*** Thank goodness! If Chi-Town got another one in – Geez! You guys just get the tip of the iceberg to his insanity. We here at the Crawlspace have to deal with the other 80%!
‘Nuff Said!
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I agree about Spidey having a tough time fighting the OotW because they are his friends so he’s pulling his punches. But something else there may be their ages – Miles, Gwen and Silk are definitely teenagers, I don’t care enough about Anya to know how old she is – only Julia and Jessica are probably Peter’s age . As a 28-ish-year-old man Spidey may not feel good about beating up teenagers.*
* Give him a few years – he’ll be ok with it.
“Underwater webbing – Would that even work?”
I read that line and it instantly made me think of “Magnets, how do they work?”
I can’t remember when it happened but I’m sure I’ve read an issue where Spidey was underwater and used his webs and the webbing turned into goop as soon as it left his webshooters and he thought “Of course, my webshooters don’t work underwater.” But it would make sense that during the Big Time (or Parker Industries) era when Peter was making lots of extra costumes he would have redesigned his webfluid formula so that it worked underwater.
All in all, I think it has been kind of a weak issue (like, we didn’t really need to see the whole battle with the Order, it was kinda implied in issue 50), but I’m ok with it because it served as a good introduction of what we’ll see in these .LR issues. And it’s promising, even with a name like Rosenberg attached to it. Not that I have anything against him, but I keep reading complaints about his writing.
Kinda funny you mention recognizable faces, Mark, because I honestly disliked how Mary Jane looks at the end. She reminds me of Squirrel Girl, with how they drew her teeth.
I’m with you on underwater webbing. I don’t think it would work, at least not normally. I expect to see the web partially dissolving and\or coming out really slower than usually, with a diminished range. And probably that’s what the artist is trying to represent there.
Well, character-wise, the brassy types play well as foils against Peter. It works the other way, right? Loud, brassy heroes do well when they’re matched with the sensible, dry-wit girlfriend. Felicia fit the mold, too, except she only liked the fun, adventurous Spider-Man persona, and thought Peter was a drip.
@Jack Brooks – she certainly defines the disastrous effects of being within Peter’s sorts of influence. Peter needs a “man o’mine” type personality to handle the turbulent situations he brings (unwillingly, but brings them nonetheless). Betty Brant is a similar character – both being unable to handle the situation, though I think Deb was the smarter of the two. I liked them thought that maybe one day she’ll need Aunt Deb!
They definitely didn’t know what to do with her!
I thought Deb Whitman had potential as someone’s effort to write an introvert female character with warm ‘home-body’ instincts. In other words, a more thoughtful, low-key personality. I bet Deb would eventually become someone else’s Aunt May in her old age, some day. So many of the female foils in ASM were brassy, dancing go-go boot chickie-babies who said things like “Man o’ mine” and tossed their hair around (even Gwen, in between crying spells, 🙂 . But maybe she was TOO similar to Peter in some ways, and in the end they didn’t know what to do with her.
It was the 90s. We don’t worry about what inspired people back then! If I remember correctly, she didn’t want the book to be mean, but the publishers did and she just really needed the money.
@Mark — Thanks for sharing that article with me — I’m not sure how I missed it when it was originally posted (almost three years ago!). I’m not really sure how Debra went from reconciling with Peter (and being cured!) after he revealed his identity to her to writing a tell-all book about how he ruined her life, especially if she didn’t believe that Peter was Spider-man. Maybe she was crazy after all. I wonder what made the ’90s animated series writers interested in featuring her as a character, if she seemed to be so unceremoniously disposed of in the comics. I guess if you’re going to have a character fall for Michael Morbius, she’s the best choice.
@Evan – Luckily for you, all you need to know about Deb Whitman is found right here on the Crawlspace in an article written by one of our more awesome writers (we have many): https://www.spidermancrawlspace.com2017/08/cobwebs-43-love-is-in-the-air-why-did-it-have-to-be-you-debra-whitman/
She is a rather silly character that pretty much derives from too many different writers at the time not knowing what was going on in continuity, but knowing that Peter is dating some chick named Deb Whitman. So, for the most of her existence, she shows up on a date with Peter and he then ghosts her so he can be Spider-Man. Then along came a writer who decided to turn that constant ghosting into a story. It’s a story so bad, that it is just fun to read. Plus, while I could care less if I ever saw Deb again, championing her as a love interest for Peter really triggers Chi-Town and THAT is a lot of fun!
@Mark — You can congratulate yourself. I just found myself thinking, “When was the last appearance of Debra Whitman?” so I looked her up and now, having just read her entry in the Marvel Database, I’m just really confused. If you have no context with which to place the characters, their entries in that wiki read really strangely. Still, at least I discovered that that’s where you got your “mystery woman” picture for your article header. My main knowledge regarding Debra Whitman, apart from knowing (1) she dated Peter and either figured out he was Spider-man and assumed it was a hallucination or actually had these hallucinations (I’m not sure which) and (2) wrote a book, is the ’90s cartoon — which treats her far more charitably, I have to say, if what I learned in today’s reasearch is any indication.
@Mark-Sure, I understand the scepticism completly…it’s hard to trust Marvel after ten years of resisting fan demand, and there have been several rug pulls over the years…but I do think Spencer is on a mission to prove Peter and MJ can face down just about anything.
@Evan & @David Blyth
Evan – Ha! Next time Chi-Town says anything to me, I’m going to yell, “MUMBLER!” I would certainly win a death match. I fight dirty. Plus I’m stronger. And better looking. As far as Harry goes, for me, I don’t think that one action undoes everything he did, but I am aware that for literary purposes, that was meant to be a redemption arc for him. I’m looking forward to seeing how Spencer handles that.
David – Good point and I’m hoping that’s the case. One of the problems with reviewing this book is now I’m looking too hard for red flags and clues to thing upcoming. Sometimes a web shooter is just a web shooter.
MJ leaving again doesn’t neccersarily mean the relationship is in trouble. The last few storylines of the newspaper strip actually dealt with a similar situation where MJ was pulled away to promote a big movie and it didn’t affect her or Peter one bit…hell, Peter wound up destroying the theatre venue she worked in and she didn’t give a hoot so long as she could get back to her hubby, she used it as an excuse to take a vacation with him!
@Mark and Chi-Town — When I read your remark to Chi-Town (“…slower this time.”) it played in my mind in the same voice that Willy Wonka uses when he says, “You should open your mouth a little wider when you speak.” I’d love to see you guys in an episode of Celebrity Death Match. 🙂
If Kindred is Harry, doesn’t that undo whatever redemption he may have gained before his death? It seems odd that he’d go to hell and such if his death was symbolic of some kind of atonement for his sins. I’m not using that as a counter-argument against Kindred’s being Harry, but I just wonder how other Spidey readers reconcile his apparent redemption in death with all that he seems to have undergone in the afterlife. I guess there could be a Mephisto-related timeline manipulation/ambiguity explanation, maybe.
Also I’m still holding on kindred being gabriel. Norman thinks it’s harry but kindred hasn’t confirmed it himself. And norman is often wrong. And remember the whole “stevie is the real 100% original cap” stunt by the same writer? So ya. Still believe it’s not harry.
My guess on Anya’s power is that she got em during spider island right? I seem to recall the spider queen was part of it and bestow different powers like organic webbing. Maybe it was part of it. She isn’t generating the spiders as much as controlling them like peter or kaine did once (after the other storyline I believe)
@Chi-Town – “I don’t think we wouldn’t be able to follow Amazing Spider-Man #51 without it.” Read that again. Slower this time.
And no, I don’t think I’ll abandon Deb just because the unenlightened don’t appreciate her. 🙂
@Evan – Don’t worry, BD is withholding my Crawlspace company car and rights to the Crawlspace beach cottage until I get all .LR issues done. At least it’s better than Amazing Grace.
I agree, we need to perfect the sound of THWIP underwater. Thlwup-pa!
As far as Chi-Town getting one up on me, well as Uncle Ben used to say, even a blind squirrel can find a nut once in a while.
@Evan: I’ve been known to be two steps ahead of Mark from time to time. The secret is for him to be very comfortable and let his shields down, then strike. LOL.
Good Review Mark. Get off the Deb train already. Making the LR issues MJ focused will encourage the reader to buy and read them, effective tactic by editorial I must say. Deb doesn’t have that kind of power, never will. My question to you is how can this book be SUPPLEMENTAL READING if you stated ” , I don’t think we wouldn’t be able to follow Amazing Spider-Man #51 without it.” Wouldn’t that make this particular issue “Required”?
@Mark — Even though this is now deemed supplemental material, I do hope you’ll continue to review the .LR issues. As commented elsewhere, I’ve received conflicting reports from Marvel as to whether this reading is required or supplemental. It could be that the former was financially motivated and the latter actually true. Hey, either way, I just feel happy to have contributed the name Webinar!
I appreciate that the onomatopoeia’s text took into account the medium through which the sound was traveling, but I’m not sure that font was actually the best choice for how it might sound underwater. I expected something more indicative of a “glub glub”-type sound. I wonder what Clayton Cole would suggest. (Sorry, couldn’t resist.)
And uh oh, Chi-Town beat you to this review! I’m not going to comment on that — I’ll just let that sink in. ‘Nuff said, as it were.
Great review!
I resent that! 90%….AT LEAST!