The Amazing Spider-Man RETURNING THIS APRIL

85 Comments

1. I have to say, while I wholly disliked the issues I read of Superior (#’s 1-9), it was in some ways a gutsy maneuver on Slott’s part from a writing standpoint (notwithstanding the number of times it’s been done before with other heroes and the sales that generated).

   That said, a new creative team on a relaunched ASM would be nice (not a Ramos fan either). I’m not sure Peter David would be enough of a draw for Marvel were he to take over writing Amazing Spider-man, but it would no doubt make for some pretty great stories.

2. @84- NatecoreUGA- First off, welcome to the site and welcome to the hobby of collecting comics. I’m sorry your first post led to a disagreement, but I hope the more you visit the site you’ll find more you like, than dislike.

   As far as renumbering. I’m going to be wishy washy and agree with both sides. When I was a kid the big numbering on Amazing Spider-Man made me want to track down the old issues and catch up. I wanted to know as much about Spider-Man as I could. It also felt like the issue I was buying was part of an ongoing legacy. In the 1980s all we had were Marvel Tales and going back and buying the actual issues. Kids today…I sound so old…have digital…trades….etc.

   However, a new start and renumbering made me buy a Batman comic regularly for the first time in 20 years. When the new 52 came out I tried a lot of books I otherwise would never pick up. I tried all the Bat books and really loved them. I also tried Batgirl, JLA and the Superman books. The Batman books are the only ones still on my pull list, but that re-boot made me try DC again.

3. @83 – Now rebooting and remembering doesn’t phase me or cause me to bat an eye. I was part of the millions that knew nothing about comics besides a passing knowledge from comics jaunts into pop culture. The lingo you’ve been using for years and that I now am familiar with was completely foreign, so anything to help smoothly usher a new reader in was helpful. I think the problem comic publishers have is still advertising outside of the comics world. I entered the LCS on a whim and the reboots and renumberings were there. It wasn’t advertising that brought me through the door. Eventually the curosity to read other comics besides Spidey crept in, but even reading the last 50 issues of Amazing’s run and through Superior there is still so much I’m missing about the entire history behind these characters where as with Batman’ s reboot nothing is lost on being a new reader. Trades, wiki and sites like the crawlspace are extremely helpful, but can only do so much. So while I know more than the brand new reader I’d still fall into that casual fan bracket spending $10-15 a month, but with more disposable income I might be willing to spend more so they still have to bring us in an keep us around.

4. @82 – I think the root of all this was using “intimidated.” That’s a very specific word. It’s making someone afraid of something. Ergo, to me your post did sound like you were saying you were afraid of it. So on my end I was sitting here thinking “How on Earth could someone be afraid of that?”

   Now I’m not attacking you here, not out to get you or something – just asking something because I’m genuinely curious. You talk about accessibility. How does rebooting something with a #1 make it more accessible? Things that happened before that #1 issue are going to be referenced. Maybe even in that same #1 issue. Typically a new #1 doesn’t erase everything that happened before. Now with that in mind – isn’t a comic with a high issue number on it but that also indicates it’s the first part of a new story be just as accessible? Because with comics that have (or had – they’re all gone now) high issue numbers there are many “jumping on” points that come around.

   No one’s “laughing you out of the building” here, Nate. Absolutely jump into the conversation. Crawlspace doesn’t have a cool kids table – it just has a table. And over in Delta House – a tiki bar!

   So from my end – hey, sorry we got off on the wrong foot. Welcome to the Crawlspace. 🙂

5. @ 75 – George, I think you understand you just don’t agree which is fine. Its much easier to get in on floor level with no strings attached and it worked for the publisher and comic book store. I bought comics I wasn’t even looking for b/c of the ease of access. I didn’t see high issue numbers and begin to feel the ground beneath me shake as I trembled in fear afraid of the trials presented within the pages of the comic. With no frame of reference I wasn’t sure about the time and money investment I was about to begin. Not everyone has a burning passion to get involved with comics. I just had a passing curiosity. A moment of fleeting levity as I was walking out of the neighboring thrift store “I know I’ll see whats happening with Spider-Man.”

   I just wanted to join in the conversation and hopefully provide a new voice/perspective a veteran to the comic world might have lost. I didn’t need to sit at the cool kids table here at the crawlspace, but I wasn’t expected to be laughed out of the building. The most appealing aspect of this site is the depth of knowledge all those involved have from the reviewers to the posters and maybe it was my fault for thinking I was going to add anything to the conversation. Casual readers are still important to publishers and they’ll do whats necessary to draw us in.

6. @80 – That’s for damn sure!

7. You know what intimidates me from a comic book? The price tag…

8. Is the comic book industry doing that poorly (economically and at drawing in new readers) that it has to resort to rebooting? Look at titles from their origin through the 90s, you don’t see all this renumbering. If D.C. or Marvel wanted a new number one, they introduced a new book in addition to what already existed. Yes D.C. had Crisis on Infinite Earths, but for the most part, the D.C. and Marvel worlds remained in tact for decades.

9. Anybody see “The Simpsons” last night? Aside from a cameo appearance by Stan Lee, the opening minutes were dedicated to the very issue of killing off a character and rebooting the comic with a new number one.

10. In an age where Wikipedia is available I find it hard to understand how someone could be intimidated about jumping onto a long-running series because they wouldn’t know all a character’s history.

11. @75 – All that and I’m no closer to understanding how a comic issue number “intimidates” you. No idea how wondering that makes me a “loudmouth bully” or “puts you on blast.” I don’t consider you an “enemy” just because you’re intimidated by a comic book issue number. Myself, I find the idea of the issue number printed on a comic being “intimidating” to be ludicrous. Especially these days when there are damn near endless avenues out there to help someone catch up or learn about a character.

    And listen, bud. If I was wanting to “exclude” you from getting into my “comic book world” I wouldn’t be working so damn hard at this site and on our podcast to expand awareness and interest of Spider-Man. No one here’s out to “get you,” no one’s trying to make you “nervous.” I’m just mind blown someone can be intimidated by a high issue number. There are things that do intimidate me sometimes. Rent, bills, doctor visits. But certainly not a high issue count on a comic. Call me as many names as you want (something I certainly didn’t do with you!) but that’s just laughable to me.

12. @ 68. Damn George, a bit high strung aren’t we. You’re actually the type of guy that makes a person nervous about getting into comics: the brash, arrogant, geek, loudmouth bully that looks to exclude all those looking to get into your comic book world knowing nothing just having an interest. I just came to say the new #1s worked to drive new business. I’ll never understand the connection to comic numbering b/c instead of someone telling me why it’s important I just get put on blast. I’m just glad the guys at my LCS were welcoming b/c unfortunately you’re not the only “George” I’ve had the displeasure of encountering. I’m not your enemy. I’m just your friendly internet Spider-Man new comer.

    @70 Intimidating is the word I wanted to use b/c that’s how I felt walking into a room filled with decades worth of stories that I only had a barely passing knowledge of. Where does one even begin at that point: never knowing anybody in my life that had read a comic before yet I was going to dive into a world filled with passionate fans assaulting me with the over zealous love for the comics they’ve spent their entire lives loving (and that’s not even getting to the stories and characters yet). It’s not as drastic as living in a foreign country alone, but it’s a apt comparison.

13. Thanks to Josh I now can’t look at this cover without thinking that Peter Parker is coming to sexually assault me.

14. I understand how #1s can be seen by a new reader as an easier jumping-on point than issue #XXX, but Spidey has done jumping-on issues in its run before without resetting to #1 and they’ve worked. The first JMS issue after the Mackie run, Slott’s first BIG TIME issue. Both of these were advertised as “the beginning of a new era in Spider-Man” and “great jumping-on points for new readers”. And IIRC they both had bigger sales numbers than previous issues. So if you make it worth the readers’ while (i.e. a new creative team, a new direction, etc) new/returning readers will buy a jumping-on issue that isn’t a #1

15. I get what #64 is saying. A new reader may want to get in on the ground floor of a book, rather than jump in the middle, so #1’s are more appealing. That’s how I became a Marlins fan – I wanted to say I’ve been a fan of a team since the beginning.

    My first experience at the comic shop was different, however. I knew I wanted to read Spider-Man and Superman, but there were so many other choices. I just grabbed whatever looked good (mostly heroes I had heard of before), read the issues and decided what I wanted to collect.

    But with so many #1’s today, I think for the serious collector the appeal is lost. Back when I first started collecting #1’s were seen as something rare, something that could be valuable one day. Like I mentioned in a prior post, I’d rather hold a milestone issue like #1,000 than just another #1.

16. @69: Groo was awesome. You can buy a Groo limited edition art book at IDW for only $1,200!! If I could afford it I would get one.
    The numbering is ridiculous and confusing. I am an older guy and was a comic buyer in the ’70,s. I stopped buying comics in 1979. I started to collect again 2.5 years ago and Spidey was tops on the list. I wanted to get caught up. I was glad to see that the numbers were where they should be. But upon further investigation-wow, what a mess. Especially among other titles like Avengers, Thor, etc. I was quick to figure out that new #1’s made for a quick profit. Now, I am a capitalist, so no problem with that, but I also can count and Marvel does take liberty with numbering to suit their bottom line. Vol. 1, vol. 2, etc- who cares.
    It would be great if they would just leave it alone. If for no other reason than nostalgia. I bet they sold plenty of 700! I think all these new #1’s make more difficult to jump on board an existing comic. Especially today with inexpensive digital comics and collections like Amazing Essential. A Spidey fan just has to read comics from the Lee/Ditko era, Romita, Sr, Gil Kane, Ross Andru, etc – they are classics.

17. Maybe “intimidating” wasn’t the best word NatecoreUGA could have picked, but I think I understand what he is getting at, even though I agree with George that in my personal experience it doesn’t matter to me what the issue number is. Most people feel they will not enjoy something if there is a significant amount of backstory they don’t understand because they’ll spend too much time wondering what is the meaning of events, dialogue etc. For me this isn’t an issue. I just infer things, and assume it will become clear over time, and it generally does.

    To be honest, I feel like if Marvel and DC are really that concerned about high numbers scaring off new readers, what would make the most sense is just to drop the numbering altogether: instead, put “[Month] [Year]” on the cover. If the book comes out more than once a month put a monthly numbering on it. Done. This might bother some people who are concerned about the numbering as collectors I guess, but I sure wouldn’t care.

18. Back during the Marvel run of Groo the Wanderer (it had 5 or 6 different publishers in its run) Sergio Aragones had a running joke in the intro pages and letter columns that because #1 issues sold better, to increase sales he wanted every issue of Groo be #1. It was a joke back then but nowadays I think Marvel might actually consider that as a concept.

    I miss Groo.

19. @64 – “Maybe I can provide the perspective of a fairly new comic book reader: it is less intimidating to pick up a comic at #1 or other low issue numbers.”

    The first Batman comic I ever picked up was right before Batman’s 400th issue and that was even when I was in junior high. A high number on a book was never “intimidating.” Back then if a comic looked cool we just picked the damn thing up and read it and didn’t give two craps about how high the number was, and figured we’d find the back issues later. I guess I’ve got no frame of reference for a comic book issue number being “intimidating.” I’m genuinely curious to know how a high number that’s not blood pressure, a tax return or a mortgage intimidates people.

    How does waiting for something to be rebooted back to #1 make something less intimidating? Does it make the previous decades worth of story and character history just up and vanish?

    @64 – “The Spider Island Epilogue was the first comic I ever bought and I was going to jump into Spider-Man regardless. I figured I’d eventually start picking up on 600+ issues of back story, but as I was in the comic book store I saw Batman had just released a new #1 and Ultimate Spider-Man had a new character and #1 issue so it was easy as a casual comic reader to hop on those at the beginning and I’ve bought every issue since then. I know you hardcore guys have an attachment to issue numbering and I’m not saying don’t complain if you want, but if I’m in the business of selling comics new #1s are a good idea.”

    Well hey – let’s just make ’em all #1’s. That way no one’s “intimidated.” Glad those big bad high numbered Superman & Batman comics aren’t around to make anyone tremble. o.O

20. @62 – Brad, but will we get #801? Marvel will resume the new numbering after #800. I don’t care myself but understand why fans do.

21. @65 – There was a lot of great JMD stuff after the Clone Saga, particularly when Norman returned as bought the Bugle. JMD made him more scary as Norman Osborn than as the Green Goblin.

    I tend to think of the Micheline run like going to see a popcorn movie. Entertaining, but not very filling.

22. @56 – The DeFalco/Frenz run was pretty damn good, but I think if I’m honest with myself, I’m enjoying Slott’s run much better… DeFalco did some good things, but they really muddled up the HobGoblin… Peter David’s Spectacular was indeed “spectacular”, but I was referencing Amazing Spider-Man writers… J.M. Dematteis’ run on ASM was good, but unfortunately, it gets lumped with early Clone Saga stories… but his Amazing Spider-Man stories (as well as his other Spidey tales) were pretty damn good (one of the gems I was referring to)… and again in the minority here, but the JMS stories did very little for me… always good premises, good build ups to his arcs, and then he ALWAYS fumbled the ball on the last parts. A lot of people liked Michelinie as well, but ASM in the 300’s were really boring to me… 🙁

23. Maybe I can provide the perspective of a fairly new comic book reader: it is less intimidating to pick up a comic at #1 or other low issue numbers. The Spider Island Epilogue was the first comic I ever bought and I was going to jump into Spider-Man regardless. I figured I’d eventually start picking up on 600+ issues of back story, but as I was in the comic book store I saw Batman had just released a new #1 and Ultimate Spider-Man had a new character and #1 issue so it was easy as a casual comic reader to hop on those at the beginning and I’ve bought every issue since then. I know you hardcore guys have an attachment to issue numbering and I’m not saying don’t complain if you want, but if I’m in the business of selling comics new #1s are a good idea.

24. I understand Marvel’s rationale behind a new #1 selling better than issue #700-and-something, and from a sales-standpoint it’s hard to debate that. But I also think issue #800 would sell better than issue #70-something.

25. The theory if #726 wouldn’t sell as good as a new #1. I’m almost 100% sure we’ll get an #800 issue though.

26. While I didn’t like the previous reboot, I liked how they eventually put both styles of numberings on the covers because back then I guess they still cared about original numberings and wanted to reach #500, #600, etc.

    As long as the first issue of this new Amazing isn’t numbered ASM #733 or whatever is 1 + the last issue of SSM will be before the new Amazing starts. As far as I’m concerned, it’ll be ASM #701 and all of SSM has just been a bad dream. If only we could get a panel of MJ waking up and finding Peter in the shower and telling him “I had the worst dream, you were killed by Doc Ock and he took over your body and he was killing people and acting like such an ass but everyone was so stupid and couldn’t figure it out.”

27. Oh, and feel free to whip out a marker and write “70” in front of each issue number, if you’re buying! 😀

28. Wacker under a pseudonym ?

29. He’s baaaaaack!

    Just kidding. I hope he’s not.

30. Oh god… wen I saw the comment count, I was afraid that someone had showed up!

31. @49 – As far as having a gap in the Spidey collection, I don’t see it as there being a gap by not collecing SSM. The last comic with Spider-Man was ASM #700. Everything after that has not been Spider-Man. It’s been an imposter, a pretender to the throne. When Peter comes back and I start buying again, years from now when I look at my comic collection I won’t say “oh there’s a lot of Spider-Man stories missing from my collection”, I’ll say “why is there a gap between #700 and the new #1? Oh yeah, right, Marvel killed off the character and replaced him. But those weren’t Spider-Man stories they were Otto G. Octavius stories so I didn’t need to buy them for my collection.”

    @54 – I can understand that a lot of people like Slott’s writing, if they didn’t then the book wouldn’t be selling. I agree with your Roger Stern comment (original Hobgoblin, oh yeah), but there’s been a lot of good since then – Tom DeFalco, Peter David, J.M. Dematteis, Howard Mackie (pre- or post-reboot, can’t remember which), Paul Jenkins, JMS. Surely those gents overshadow the rest and it hasn’t been “a LOT of mediocre” since Stern.

32. Always in the minority here, but I’ve enjoyed Slott’s run in both the BND, Big Time, AND Superior runs… and I’m very happy that he’s going to stay with the character. I’ve not felt this kind of attachment to Spider-Books since the days of Roger Stern… and that’s been a LOT of mediocre books in between. (barring the odd gem here and there)

    Looking forward to Peter’s return, and let’s hope Miguel takes over the Superior book.

    Thanks for respecting my opinion.

    🙂

33. @46- “So, given how much of likable chaps you are, is it really any wonder why Slott and Marvel hate you?”
    And then you said “(you’ll know if I am because the first thing I’d do is execute Quesada in a few creative ways)”

    INSTANT BAN. Seriously WTF? This is the first time I’ve seen you on the board, but you are giving fans a horrible image.

34. If that’s still Ock in the costume, he looks like he just took viagra.

35. #47-49 Well, I dropped the book after OMD because the localizing company also did, probably sharing the same contempt for the story, but when I got means of getting it otherwise I found myself really enjoying Slott’s run, Spider-Island, increasingly prevalent role of the Goblins, et cetera. I was shocked of course to see Superior Spider-Man happen, but I gave it a chance and now I think it breaks a new ground of adding one archetype to the anti-hero archetypes, which before this consisted of a whopping… one. A whiny brooding asshole. Plenty of heroes got turned into that to the point I couldn’t pick up a single comic book about anything without thinking the protagonist would have killed themselves already. And now there is a protagonist that is actually pleased with himself and ironically brings some damn joy in the comic books already.

    But he’ll be shoved aside in less time than it takes to blink, which just makes me bring another one of the “status quo is god” depressing confirmations. I knew this will happen, but I wanted it to last longer. I like Superior, but I understand why people don’t. What I don’t understand is why not a single thing the fans claim “pisses them off” ever resulted in any damage to Marvel since Clone Saga. That is what I resent about today’s customers, they are essentially toothless. Nothing matters anymore, a company can release literal shit and everyone will buy it once they put a brand on it. For example, those of you who are gamers know that EA’s latest fuckup in their comically large list of fuckups caught many gamers “by surprise”. It’s as if EA had a history of making barely finished pathetic cash grabs… OH WAIT.