Goodbye Amazing, Hello Superior Spider-Man

85 Comments

1. Bleeding Cool is reporting that “Dan Slott Reveals That Spider-Man And Mary Jane Will Get Back Together – But Peter Parker Is NOT Spider-Man”
   http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/10/11/dan-slott-talks-superior-spider-man-at-nycc/

2. It swings from extreme to extreme (haha see what I did there?). We had “nobody dies Peter”, and something will happen where Peter has the ability to save him but chooses to let him die knowing that if he lives hell just keep coming after him.

   Why would ock need grapplers if he was in peters body? His body would still have the powers. And he wouldn’t be superior if he didnt even have the base skill set.

   My money is on a rehashing of the 90’s I Am the Spider story. Stop feeding me poop for 3.99 Marvel. At least give me some lipstick to look pretty if you’re gonna @#?! me.

3. Stillanerd, you know, I don’t really agree that any of this has to do with a spider-mutation because there’s very little evidence for that, but looking at the cover it does look like he’s digging into the wall with his claws. Now I think these claws are for climbing with, which explains why they are on both the hands and the feet.

   Maybe this is Peter after losing his powers. He now needs hooks to climb and thicker eyepieces because his vision has returned to its pre-spider-bite levels.

   If this is Doc Ock, I think the goggle lenses are because goggles are his trademark, and not because he needs them to see.

4. If that JOE QUESADA variant cover for #700 listed on e-bay is accurate, I wonder if it is just a bad drawing or indicative of what is going to come afterwards. Maybe Spidey gives birth to this thing like in the movie “Alien” ….

5. … so much for me and BD going buck-wild in Vegas. And they’re still not going to do anything about OMD. Sorry, still don’t care.

6. SOME of Spidey’s best stories are dark, but not ALL of them. Howard Mackie’s run got progressivly darker and it became a depressing crybaby chore to read, with the two-part House of Osborn story from him and Jenkins the near sole highlight. JMS’s run was quite dark, and while it had some good stories like “The Conversation”, Peter and MJ’s airport reunion, and “Happy Birthday”, it was mired by the Spider Totem malarky and the ill-advised “Sins Past”. Dark stories can work, but that doesnt mean they all do.

   Back to Crazychris’ theory: It’s also sound if you know Slott’s history with a classic Pantomime trope…Dan always does this, but he lets the audience in on who the big bad guy is behind the mask before any of the comic book characters ever find out. He wanted to do it with Menace but editorial stopped him, but he was able to do it with Phil as The Hobgoblin. A year later and noone has yet to put two and two together with him, all while the reader is saying “boo hiss, he’s behind you”. I enjoy that little trick, but I wouldnt like it if it were used all the time, and if the “Doc Ock takes over Peter” thing is true, that would be one example of the trick being taken to ridiculous extremes.

7. Some of Spidey’s best stories are “dark,” why not wait and read before preemptively judging? Oh wait … the internet…right…

8. @#35 CrazyChris–Well, the reason why he mentions Doc Ock will die is because the twist is not will he die (remember, he’s already dying in this story) but HOW he will die. Him actually being killed by Spider-Man WOULD BE the twist to his death. Also, you’re mentioning how the Sinister Spider-Man evokes Doc Ock’s goggles, not to mention the suggestion that the retractable claws could be his inventing new abilities, as possible evidence Doc Ock is in Peter’s body–if Doc Ock’s mind is in Peter’s body, he would therefore inherit ALL of Peter’s powers and physical abilities, correct? So then, why would Doc Ock still need goggles/glasses if he has Peter’s perfect 20/20 vision? And why would he need to invent retractable claws for himself to replicate Spidey’s wall-crawling abilities if he already has Peter’s wall-crawling powers? (Unless that fits in with your other idea that Doc Ock gets a new, younger body in issue #700). Plus, why are we assuming the retractable claws are technological in origin? They could just as easily be biological. After all, Stegman says in that article that the alterations to Spidey’s costume also tie into new abilities he has, which suggest new powers.

9. I was pretty okay with the idea of Ock in Spidey’s body until someone mentioned the whole Mary Jane thing. That gives me the creeps. I really, sincerely hope that doesn’t happen.

10. Nothing is really new, because:
    1. We had a dark and edgy Spider-Man in Back in Black, and before it there was the symbiote arc in the 90s cartoon
    2. Spider-Man 2099 has retractable claws
    3. “The Other” stinger power comes to mind with the claw
    4. He had so many costumes, this one wouldn’t make much of a difference with the minor changes the added
    5. If this is not Peter, we saw another Spider-Man who is not Peter before

11. Finger and toe claws scream tarantula to me, so I’m guessing it’s Kaine mutating back to how he looked after the end of grim hunt (either by parker particles or something with minimum carnage) with the extra eyeballs which is why he needs the non-emotion eye lenses.

12. Has Marvel still not learnt anything from the clone saga? These major character changes are not wanted by the fan base and the gimmicks don’t bring in steady fans.

    I don’t hate Dan Slott and in fact loved Spider Island. But I honestly don’t think he’s truly good enough to be a marque Spidey writer. Temp fill in is his best role. He certainly should not be presiding over major character changes.

    Now I’m usually pretty open minded about things like this. I loved the clone saga until they decided it was OK to remove Peter from the books. And I was willing to give BND a shot despite being a massive fan of the marriage (OMIT was the dagger in my heart). And I am willing to believe this may be an entertaining distraction.

    But I am upset that the other shake ups from Mavel Now look like interesting ways to refresh titles with new creative teams. But Spider-Man is the SAME (below average) creative team but major and unwanted changes to the character.

    Seriously if we once again have a long term Spider-Man title that DOES NOT include Peter, I’m done. I’ll keep reading, because I’m a Spider-Man fan for life. But I won’t be buying them anymore until Peter is back (or rather I’ll quit if he’s not back when my subscription runs out).

    My only hope is that Peter gets MJ back and when this Superior nonsense is over we go back to pre-OMD continuity. I’d take JMS back in a heartbeat!

13. Stillanerd, why would Slott spoil Doc Ock’s death unless there was going to be some twist to it? Doc Ock’s body will die but his mind will live on in Peter’s body. Also, Slott is calling attention to Spidey’s eyes in that interview. His eyes are designed to look like goggles. That more than anything else should persuade anyone that this is Otto. Whether he steals Peter’s body or somehow becomes very fit in another way is debatable, but the basic fact that this is Otto as Spidey is a very safe bet at this point.

14. Not feeling this at all.

15. Looking at the logo, why does it looked paper-clipped and taped together?

16. No matter how this pans out, a more appropriate title would be WTF SpiderMan.

    Spider-Man with retractable talons? Not so friendly Spider-Man, (oooh he is edgy now, look it’s the ’90’s!). Hero or Menace? OK, that I remember. None of these changes seem to be an improvement, even the black replacing the blue was done in Ultimate Spider-Man.

    However, if I was a Vegas odds maker Amazing Spider-Man volume 3 will be announced to coincide with the 50th Anniversary of ASM #1.

    I must admit the guesses are fun to read. CrazyChris, if you are right…boy I can’t wait to hear that podcast…

17. Here’s another reason why I don’t think CrazyChris’ “Doc Ock and Peter switch bodies” theory may not be correct. If Doc Ock switched did minds with Peter, then wouldn’t he have ALL of Peter’s abilities, including wall-crawling and perfect 20/20 vision? Why would he need to invent retractable claws to climb on walls if he already has Spidey’s wall-crawling abilities; and why would he have lenses that work like his own glasses with he also has Peter’s eyesight?

18. Crazy Chris wins the theory timeline. But this direction is a turn-off to me, no matter why or how it comes about. Grim n’ gritty is so 90s, and not good for Spider-Man.

19. I kinda agree with the other boards that this is redundant, we already have Kaine for the dark version of Spider-Man. “Non-emotional” Spidey eyes and Ramos … I’d have to see it to believe it.

20. @27–Then again, Slott and Marvel also seem to suggest that it’s not Peter Parker under the mask and an entirely brand new Spider-Man. Which would also go back to an earlier theory I had–that Spidey, because he kills Doc Ock, quits as Spidey for good and a new guy takes his place. Just covering my bases, folks.

21. Hi guys,

    Never posted on this site before, but I had to look around the forums after seeing the story in USA Today. I was really curious to see what fans thought who would be Spidey in the Superior title.

    After reading the article describing how Spider-Man was going to have a new darker and more ruthless attitude toward his enemies and then seeing the pictures of him in his new costume, am I the only one who’s thinking it could be Miguel O’Hara? I haven’t seen anything in the current Amazing comics that points to bringing him from 2099, but it sure sounds like Miguel; attitude, talons, even the lenses and that weird comment about his mouth could have something to do with Miguel as he had enhanced vision and sharp canine teeth he could inject venom from.

22. Well, I certainly think the odds of Alpha being new Superior Spider-Man certainly dropped. However, I respectfully disagree with CrasyChris that the new Superior Spider-Man will be Doc Ock in Peter’s body. For one thing, the USA Today article points out that Spidey has already become “darker” by showing less compassion towards his villains in the wake of Silver Sable’s supposed death post Ends of the Earth. Secondly, the title of the first story in the series is going to be “Hero or Menace?” which suggests it’s going back to the idea of Spidey being distrusted by the public once again. And it talks about a new Sinister Six with a brand new member. All of this seems to suggest that Doc Ock will be killed and that Spidey is the one responsible for his death. In fact, Slott seems to have spoiled Doc Ock’s fate in a Q&A he did with Marvel:

    “Marvel.com: What villains are we going to see specifically? I hear things about a new Sinister Six…

    Dan Slott: Yes. With THE DEATH OF DOC OCK and the recent Sinister Six falling aside, a bunch of Spider-villains will try to pick up the mantle. They’ll go “hey, no one’s using it, the name’s got some cred, we are the Sinister Six. “

    http://marvel.com/news/story/19523/marvel_now_qa_superior_spider-man#ixzz28wj1Ry35

    Furthermore, the article talks about how the alterations to Spidey’s costume will tie into “new abilities,” which not only include the altered eye-lenses but retractable claws on his hands and toes. If it was really Doc Ock in Peter’s body, why would Doc Ock suddenly have clawed fingers and toes? Unless of course Spidey also gets mutated. And guess what? In that same Q&A:

    “What did they think of the big changes? Are they excited to try out some new stuff?

    Dan Slott: Well, yeah. Cammo’s already done a cover, and it’s a more brutal Spider-Man than we’ve seen. We’ve already got a cover out by Humberto that really highlights some of the new changes to the costume and the new look for this Spider-Man. Since the days of the Joe Quesada teaser for Marvel NOW!, we really haven’t seen that much of Spidey because he’s doubled over. All you can really tell is SOMETHING’S WRONG WITH HIS EYES; something was weird with the eyes— what’s going on? But we’ll see more as the days get closer.”

    Someone over at CBR posted a theory awhile ago that suggested that Spidey would get enhanced abilities after being bitten by Kevin’s favorite vampire, Morbius, going as far as to suggest Peter will inherit the character’s craving for blood. If Spidey is actually mutating as this supposed cover Slott talks about suggests, then there’s perhaps credence for that theory now.

23. Otto in Peter’s body sounds like a decent idea, and to be honest, it’ll be interesting to see Octavius do something to really elevate him into Spider-Villain A-list. Stealing Spider-Man’s entire life and sticking him in a dying body, then running off with his life, would be a big deal. And I’ve read Slott’s Arkham Asylum mini, and that was actually some pretty screwed up stuff, so if he can bring a bit of that mentality to bear here, this could be a good read. No reason this won’t work.

    And if it is Otto in Peter’s body, then surely everyone going “Yeah, whatever, let’s see how long this lasts” is missing the point. That kind of story has to be finite – Peter has to come back and fight for his body. Marvel aren’t losing face if it isn’t permanent, because there’s no way it would ever be.

24. For the Otto in Peter’s body theory, what happens to Peter (and his conscious brain)? In Ock’s body? Dead? Or does the Otto in Peter’s body work like the Ronnie Raymond/Martin Stein/Firestorm? I guess this question is for you CrazyChris…

    Could Otto have taken over Kaine’s body? Kaine did kill Otto (which would be poetic justice) and it would work for the edgy/darker Spidey…

25. The opposite of “superior” is “inferior.”

    -your friendly neighborhood thesaurus.

26. My theory is that it’s going to be (sigh) Alpha, who Marvel is dead set on despite the fact he was about as popular as the flu by the readers. The claws could very well be to allow him to climb walls, since he doesn’t have that power.

    I have to agree with Alonso that Dan Slott’s writing resembles fanfiction-I’m just surprised to hear anybody at Marvel actually SAY it in an official press release. But Dan Slott somparing himself to Spider-Man’s god?. That I’m not surprised by.

    That said, a few of the costume innovations aren’t so bad, primarilly because they’re refinements: The replacement of black with blue and elimination of teh red webbing arm stripes? Not really needed but acceptable. A modification of teh eyepieces? That’s done a lot.

    Overall, I’m neither surprised, nor terribly interested.

27. Superior….superior…what’s the opposite of superior, which this is?

28. I have no idea where you guys are getting this Ock/Peter switch thing. I thought it was a joke when Chris originally suggested it. I don’t put anything past them, but that one is kind of hard for me to buy…

29. Another thing to add to the comparision between BND and the Mackie-Byrne Reboot. I am really annoyed that they are changing ASM to Superior Spider-Man. Bets on how long before we go back to Amazing?

30. Now let’s see how long this will last.

    ~Lament~

31. To set the record straight, Brad’s theory was that Peter would get Alpha’s powers, not that Alpha would become Spider-Man. I have reasons for doubting both:

    The new Spider-Man is probably not Peter Parker because:
    – the character described in the USA today story is too dark and mean to be Peter
    – the adjective “superior” does not fit Peter’s personality. It’s a word villains use to describe themselves. Furthermore, if Peter WAS going to go dark, it would because he’s in a whiney self-loathing period because he screwed up. That’s his character. Nothing about that direction fits the word “superior,” which implies self-praise by the “hero.”
    – a lot of teases from Marvel editors have hinted that Peter is leaving, including Alonso saying “it seems like a pretty good final year for Ol’ pete” (google it)
    – The theory that this will be Peter with Alpha’s powers makes no sense because why would someone with cosmic energy powers give himself toe-claws?

    The new Spider-Man is probably not Andy “Alpha” McGuire because
    – Alpha is an ostentatious, attention craving, flamboyant character. He doesn’t seem like he would come back as a dark, gritty vigilante who attacks people with claws
    – The concept art specifies that his eyes need to be “emotionless.” Alpha is not an emotionless character, but rather an over emotional one. Ock, however, has emotionless eyes because of his goggles. Look how much the eye pieces are designed to resemble goggle lenses
    – Alpha doesn’t seem resourceful or intelligent enough to design gadgets like the retractable toe claw

    The new Spider-Man probably IS Otto Octavius in Peter’s body because
    – He has all the character traits described in the article
    – Doc Ock would absolutely consider himself “superior.” That word jives with his personality more than any other Spidey character
    – The eyepieces look like his goggles
    – The concept art specifies an “alien nose,” referring to the web pattern around the nose. This makes the character appear more animalistic and otherworldly . . . like an octopus
    – He could invent new abilities for himself like retractable claws
    – It would explain why the sinister six will need a new member
    – It would explain Slott’s earlier comment about MJ and Peter getting what they want but not how they want it–MJ thinks she’s with Peter but it’s really Otto
    – We know the final ASM story arc involves Doc Ock
    – This would resolve the “Doc Ock is dying” plot

    I think that summarizes why my theory is what it is, and why it is the theory that makes the most sense and fits the best with what we know.

32. “So Peter and MJ will get back together, but MJ will be unknowingly dating Otto..kinda distubing if accurate, but it synchs up well with the rumours of us getting what we want, but not quite the way we want it”
    This makes a lot of sense with what they have been saying for awhile. I could really see them doing Chris’s prediction but I wouldn’t rule out Brad’s with Alpha being the new Spidey either.

33. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand I’m Done.

34. Ock kills Peter Parker. Curt Connors brings him back to life with lizard venom or some such thing so he grows stingers and an attitude. I’m amazed Aunt May survives – thought that was what would drive Peter crazy.

35. Nevermind, I just read the article and it says it IS replacing ASM. Not happy about that at all.

36. So does this replace “The Amazing Spider-Man”? If so, I’m not cool with that.

37. @10, I first suggested the idea that Peter and Ock will switch bodies and Ock will become “The Superior Spider-Man” on September 21st in this message board thread: http://spidermancrawlspace.com/wwwboard/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3703&p=185399#p185399

    So anyone who wants to claim having that prediction earlier than me would have to beat the date of 9-21-2012.

38. Costume looks intriguing. I agree with CrazyChris, this is Doc Ock. This also fits the description of how the Spidey changes in #700 will affect the rest of the MU – Doc Ock will be on the Avengers!

39. Is it impossible to write good Spider-man stories without endless stupid gimmicks?…

40. Did Crazy Chris come up with this first? I suggested the idea at #29 in an earlier comment thread.

41. I have NO idea where you guys are getting this body switch idea from. I mean, I’m always saying I wouldn’t put anything past them, and it’s true, but this just seems out of nowhere to me.

    Whatever the case it sounds like these guys are pumping up another OMD and are super excited about it. Great. I guess it could be interesting to see Slott trying a different approach to the character, but I don’t like the sound of anything else here.

42. Awesome… can’t wait for this!

43. Just read the article… I love that Axel Alonso recognizes that Slott’s ideas come off as fanfic, but I hate everything else about this. Actually, that’s not true. I do also love that Marvel’s given me a perfect place to end my Spidey run and saved me a lot of money in the process.

44. “Yeah, this Spider-Man is Otto in Peter’s body, I’d bet like five bucks on it. His eyepieces look like Ock’s goggles and the Sinister Six will have a new member because their old leader is Spider-Man.”

    I think you’re right and i think it sounds terrible. They could not raise the sales on the book with “Big Time” with out gimmicks and variant covers, so they are going to ruined it more with bad stuns.

    That’s Marvel for you.

45. So Peter and MJ will get back together, but MJ will be unknowingly dating Otto..kinda distubing if accurate, but it synchs up well with the rumours of us getting what we want, but not quite the way we want it

46. *Looks at calender* Crap, it’s not an April Fools prank…

    Welp, on the other hand, look how over-hyped Alpha was and how that turned out. Watch this will be akin to that and Amazing Vol 3 #1 will be rolling out by Springtime.

47. Take it away Vader….
    “NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!”

48. Aggressive! Angry! Mean! GRRRR! ….meh.

49. A new Dan Slott? Darker, edgier Dan Slott?

    Oh Hell.

50. Yeah, this Spider-Man is Otto in Peter’s body, I’d bet like five bucks on it. His eyepieces look like Ock’s goggles and the Sinister Six will have a new member because their old leader is Spider-Man.