Ultimate Spider-Man Animated Series

[George Berryman]

Didn't you say you stopped reading the series during #7, or are you still Byrne-stealing them? Bendis hasn't used that style of dialogue in USM for a quite a while.

I reviewed the first six and Byrne-stole probably a dozen after that, all before 2003, back when I was able to read the retailer copies so I could review them a week in advance. And I definitely stand by what I said cause that is precisely how it was written then; repetitive and stretched out to fill a trade.

[George Berryman]

It doesn't bother me because USM was not meant to replace the 616 universe it was an alt take on it.

Going to disagree there. Jemas was the first driving force front man on the Ultimate line and he used to always bitch and bitch about how necessary it was because that terrible, bastardly continuity that the customers love was making it "really really hard" to tell stories. And yes, that line of thinking was wrong then and its wrong now. As the publisher I have no doubt that Jemas wanted and intended the Ultimate line to supplant the original Marvel Universe when it was conceived.

Up to that point I could take or leave USM at my leisure because 616 Spidey was still in print until they ended it with #545.

I see what you did there and I approve.

[CyberGhostface]

I reviewed the first six and Byrne-stole probably a dozen after that, all before 2003, back when I was able to read the retailer copies so I could review them a week in advance. And I definitely stand by what I said cause that is precisely how it was written then; repetitive and stretched out to fill a trade.

That's at least seven years, more if it's before 2003. The title has changed considerably since then. Not that it was ever as bad as you make it out to be, but Bendis has dropped the use of the infamous "No." "No?" "No." teen dialogue among other things.

[SpiderPlumber]

Why cancel SSM??? Why make a new series?? The way Ultimate Spider-Man was written, (self-contained story arcs) lends it perfectly to DIRECT TO DVD MOVIES!!!!!! They haven't put out a good Spidey animated DVD (that isn't just a collection from a TV series) in ages!

[George Berryman]

That's at least seven years, more if it's before 2003. The title has changed considerably since then. Not that it was ever as bad as you make it out to be

It was. One might even say it was infamously bad.

... but Bendis has dropped the use of the infamous "No." "No?" "No." teen dialogue among other things.

See? Infamous. And yay for Bendis!

[CyberGhostface]

It was. One might even say it was infamously bad.

You might say it was, but that doesn't necessarily make it objective fact. If it was that bad, Bendis and Bagley wouldn't have broken the the record for longest run by a creative team on a Marvel title, and it would have been cancelled well before it's 100th issue like you said it would be. If it was infamously bad, it wouldn't have received the amount of critical and popular success that it did. If it was infamously bad, people like Stan Lee wouldn't have listed Bendis as one of his favorite writers (and in the same interview, he stated that he didn't like the new status quo for Spider-Man, so it's not like he was sucking up to Marvel at the time).

[George Berryman]

You might say it was, but that doesn't necessarily make it objective fact. If it was that bad, Bendis and Bagley wouldn't have broken the the record for longest run by a creative team on a Marvel title, and it would have been cancelled well before it's 100th issue like you said it would be. If it was infamously bad, it wouldn't have received the amount of critical and popular success that it did. If it was infamously bad, people like Stan Lee wouldn't have listed Bendis as one of his favorite writers (and in the same interview, he stated that he didn't like the new status quo for Spider-Man, so it's not like he was sucking up to Marvel at the time).

So good it even wound up getting rebooted. How's that goin' by the way... ?

[CyberGhostface]

Interesting how you keep on changing the subject instead of just responding to the arguments.

The "reboots" had less to do with the quality of USM by itself and more to do with the Ultimate line as a whole. Obviously Ultimatum was a bad decision by Marvel and it soured a lot of people on the line, but Bendis had nothing to do with that. A lot of people dropped the title because of the Ultimatum miniseries, and a couple of people here have even admitted to dropping it because of OMD/BND and their dissatisfaction with Spidey in general. None of which was Bendis's fault.

Even so, considering how much Marvel pretty much let Jeph Loeb go crazy on the rest of the Ultimate titles and kill off half the cast, the fact that Bendis was allowed to keep control over his title the way he wanted to says a lot.

[Thrawn]

George Berryman wrote:

Going to disagree there. Jemas was the first driving force front man on the Ultimate line and he used to always bitch and bitch about how necessary it was because that terrible, bastardly continuity that the customers love was making it "really really hard" to tell stories. And yes, that line of thinking was wrong then and its wrong now. As the publisher I have no doubt that Jemas wanted and intended the Ultimate line to supplant the original Marvel Universe when it was conceived.

That probably is correct but my statement was only meant to explain why I didn't have a problem with USM changing some of the characters around, as compared to the Spec show which was largely meant to be a more faithful adaptation of the 616 universe. I should have clarified what I meant. My bad George.

I see what you did there and I approve.

[George Berryman]

Interesting how you keep on changing the subject instead of just responding to the arguments.

There's really not much to argue about here. You think it's like a golden stairway to Shangri-La covered in candy and beer. I think it's a deeply flawed "reimagined" copy of an awesome original and is now just a reconstituted shadow of itself. There's not a lot of common ground there except to maybe say Bagley rocks.

I've said before if people are enjoying that - hey, they can knock themselves out with it. More power to 'em.

The "reboots" had less to do with the quality of USM by itself and more to do with the Ultimate line as a whole. Obviously Ultimatum was a bad decision by Marvel and it soured a lot of people on the line, but Bendis had nothing to do with that. A lot of people dropped the title because of the Ultimatum miniseries, and a couple of people here have even admitted to dropping it because of OMD/BND and their dissatisfaction with Spidey in general. None of which was Bendis's fault.

Even so, considering how much Marvel pretty much let Jeph Loeb go crazy on the rest of the Ultimate titles and kill off half the cast, the fact that Bendis was allowed to keep control over his title the way he wanted to says a lot.

Fine - it's all Loeb's fault and Bendis has never ever made a misstep on USM. Even with the repetitive dialogue and writing for the trade.

[Kassady86]

While I still favor the 90s animated series, Spectacular was an excellent program. That last episode of season 2 left a lot of open avenues that unfortunately may never be traveled. As far as this series is concerned, I'm not a big fan of anything Ultimate, but I'm sure curiosity will get the better of me for at least 1 episode. Spectacular should have continued, but after this incredibly long delay, I can honestly say that I'm not as sad as I would have been months ago.

[CrazyChris]

I have mixed feelings on this.

Pros:
-Ultimate Spider-Man, despite what George is saying, has been a consistently good series month after month for a decade. It’s the McDonald’s Quarter Pounder of Spider-Man runs; sure, it ain’t filet mignon, but at least you get what you expecting every time and the quality is always within certain acceptable parameters.

-Based on the promotional poster, it looks like it will be based on Mark Bagley’s art style, which is FAR more appealing than the style of Spectacular Spider-Man.

-The “writing for the trade” for which USM has been criticized actually makes it more adaptable to television than the classic stories. The reason Bendis takes so many issues to tell the story is that he writes with cinematic pacing in mind, whereas writers from past decades were more concerned with cramming as much information into every panel as possible, even at the sacrifice of a more organic flow to the storytelling. When I read a Bendis comic, I almost feel like I’m watching a movie on paper. That means his work is ready-made for television.

Cons:
-This probably means Spectacular Spider-Man is gone, which means no more of Greg Weisman’s Spider-Man. That’s a damn shame.

-I don’t get what the point of starting a new series about a high school-aged Spider-Man is when we already have a perfectly good one that already has two seasons of groundwork laid out. It seems redundant to have to establish a whole new series when any story you can tell in the new continuity can be readily told in the existing one. Also, Spec was already influenced by USM. For example, it’s interpretation of Eddie Brock is pretty much lifted right from Bendis’s Venom story.

[CyberGhostface]

You think it's like a golden stairway to Shangri-La covered in candy and beer.

I never pretended that USM was flawless. Bendis has done a number of things throughout the series that I disagree with and thought were poorly executed. That doesn't mean that there's a lot of good stuff as well..

Fine - it's all Loeb's fault and Bendis has never ever made a misstep on USM. Even with the repetitive dialogue and writing for the trade.

Never said that. What I am saying is that is that a lot of people dropped the Ultimate line because of Ultimatum because they thought it ruined everything, and that a few more dropped USM because of their dissatisfaction with all things Spider-Man thanks to OMD. Even K-Box, who is no fan of Bendis, has said that Loeb hurt the series' sales in the long run.

[Stuart Green]

4/13/2010


How ironic that this news happens to occur on the 13th, which is an unlucky number. And certainly is for "The Spectacular Spider-Man". I actually have a "Spectacular Spider-Man" fan site AND a "Spider-Man: The Animated Series" fan site. You can find both here:

http://specspideyfansite.yolasite.com/
http://foxspideyfansite.yolasite.com/

I'll be updating the Spectacular site shortly with the news of the show's likely cancellation. MAN, this stinks. I never really cared for "Ultimate Spider-Man", and seeing an animated series of it doesn't get me too thrilled, especially since it's going to follow/replace such a brilliant, beloved, critically-acclaimed show as "The Spectacular Spider-Man". Man, Greg Weisman and company must be bummed out that there won't be a third season. They did an amazing job (no pun intended) with the series. Since the whole Disney/Marvel thing happened, I wondered what Disvel was gonna do about the show. Now that I know, I can't put my disappointment and sadness into proper words.

R.I.P. "Spectacular Spider-Man". You deserved better.

- Stuart Green

[bdog]

This pisses me off so much!